Denithan

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Denithan last won the day on June 3

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About Denithan

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    Too plentiful to cover, but I have a strong affinity for most card games.
  1. More meant that one about A19, but still, fair point xD
  2. Man, that Krillin's Kamehameha just feels REALLY solid.
  3. You know, while we're talking about these android personalities, I'm kind of curious. Do you lot think there's still room for Androids 19 and 20 in this current meta game at all, or if there was EVER room for them in the meta?
  4. Orange Ret 18 could be interesting, but Orange Ret is such that pretty much anyone can run it and do decently well so long as the person behind the wheels is a little familiar with their plays. Still though, the ability to shuffle your drills back in during your opponent's combat and redraw could be valuable at level 1, and you'd be hitting level 2 awfully fast. As for 17, I got no clue. Try as I might, I've never gotten him to work in Red. His Ally focus might work well with some Orange styles with their newer drills, but it doesn't feel like the reward is worth the cost. Try Black, as someone else suggested. He might pull off some fun moves.
  5. I don't know how I feel about a myriad of drills in there. And that ending tidbit about an ultra rare freestyle drill has me a bit concerned |:
  6. I mean, at like, 5-6 different points Vegeta was the strongest Z-Fighter. Piccolo was the strongest at least twice, after Nail and then after Kami. Gohan was pretty frequently the strongest too, and probably one of the more interesting ones. We've seen for a fact that Krillin can outsmart/outmaneuver some foes to overwhelm them with a series of surprise attacks in Ball, Z and Super. Future Trunks, I don't think was ever the strongest Z-Fighter, but was in the top 2 quite frequently. Tien saps his own life, but can keep up with people up to Future Trunks' level (Bojack movie included). Also, he surprise attacked Cell into the ground. And Buu, I think? I need to rewatch that arc. Thematically speaking, Goku only becomes a major powerhouse in the series after Blue Kaioken comes up, and that's so far god damn down the line that it doesn't really deserve mentioning. Why is this idea of "only Goku" still permeating? o-O He spent more time incapacitated in Z than he did on screen! And are you kidding me? o-O Hand knowledge, even without the ability to discard the opponent's hand, would be a huge advantage. Tells me straight-up how many blocks the opponent has, and how much they can stop an endless advance from Saiyan Empowered. Or heck, Red Ruthless with all their dual attacks could just look and decide if it was worth going to town.
  7. I mean, you have a point with the in-built hand knowledge, Saiyan just doesn't have much in the way of deck destruction I don't believe (I could be mistaken. If so, then I rescind the statement). And I don't really like his level 2's active power nearly as much as any of his other levels.
  8. Because Bardock was a Saiyan. His heroic acts at the end of his life aside, he openly admitted to, with his allies, enjoying and taking delight in the slaughtering and genocide of entire planets. They make it a point that he used his Oozaru form to wipe people out for shits and gigs. He was not a nice man. Even his "heroic acts" were more about self-defense and the Saiyans than they were about helping anyone else, including the Bardock special where he gets Super Saiyan. Chilled pissed him off because he reminded him of Frieza, and was threatening Bardock's current place of residence. By the actual canon, he's a prick xD
  9. I'm actually just angry at how good Bardock seems. The hell. Edit: Minus his level 2. Kind of a trend forming in me not liking Villainous Saiyan level 2s. And I was really hoping he'd be the one for Dynamic. Dang it.
  10. You know, after reading your reasoning, I've kind of come around to your viewpoint. Even trying to really build something in Black, most of their best and least circumstantial cards are little more than vanilla attacks. Huh. That said, don't know if I'd say Saiyan has a bad card pool atm. Might be alone in that thought, but I've generally found their options pretty plentiful regardless of how you want to play it (excluding DBV. I'd just be impressed to see a Saiyan Style ever win by DBV).
  11. Honestly, I think the main issue everyone has with Unleashed is the ability to delevel your opponent (if they can't win by MPPV), which is admittedly a bit overpowered. I've not really seen anyone with huge problems with the level up side of the effect since most decks have some way or another to pretty much pull that anyway.
  12. Honestly, that strikes me as needlessly complex and giving way too much of an advantage to the player going second who can straight up decide which battleground to use. That would very easily, and very quickly, create just as much imbalance as was present in the old game (but at least they'd get used though, I suppose). Using your examples with the World Tournament, that could straight up kill a large number of decks (like Namekian Restored Gohan), and so long as you go second, your opponent has no chance to stop it. A card that can potentially give such a huge advantage in the early and late games shouldn't be just dropped into play without response, and I don't think there's a good balance where Battlegrounds are relevant and not unfair with that system in tow. Honestly, with how you're working it there (with Battlegrounds not counting towards deck limit), just make them side of game cards. It's simpler, and then it becomes straight up impossible for them to be returned to your deck regardless and you don't need to explain that ruling of being banished when going to deck to newcomers. They'll learn about using Battlegrounds as they learn about MPs and Masteries, and you can use the exact same system only with flipping the card face-down instead of putting it into a banished zone (which also saves time digging through banished to get it out in the build up to the next game). With that proposed system, you'd need to create specific battleground support to grab them back from Banished anyway, so legitimately just make it flip up your or your opponent's battleground (with the ruling that face-down Battlegrounds are basically treated as "not on the field" and that only one can be face-up regardless). While you didn't really clarify, if you're intending it so that you can have multiple battlegrounds in your deck, then it would probably be better to go with ManOfTomorrow's idea where you have a collection of 3 (max) and put 1 forward for the current match at the start. It should also be noted that it'd be best to make Battlegrounds optional to keep the current game state intact. Make it so if you rocked up without a Battleground, you can just use Critical Effects to knock out the opponent's and you're not forced to play to their advantage from the start (since people would 100% play Battlegrounds that just support their present strategy). Ultimately, I really do think that Battlegrounds should have conditions under which they can be used/brought into play, and make it something people need to work towards instead of just drop to the board. This would also make them distinct from drills, setups and allies; something you actually need to try and bring out. This would also give a mechanic through which you can balance battlegrounds; really overpowered ones could come with more extensive costs to play, and simpler ones like your Cell's Arena or Kami's Lookout could be on the simpler side (also, this means that you could just make it so if your opponent criticals your battleground out of play, you just need to meet the conditions of activation a second time to bring it back. Saves us making a LOT of support).
  13. Nappa as an MP stack is/was fine. He's no Broly, but he can use the power-level restricted cards as well, and it gives him a solid enough niche that he's actually turned up in a few competitive scenes and done really well. And while his current level 2 isn't as strong as this, it's nice in that it's pretty unique all in all (where this is just a stronger version of Turles' Level 1/A weaker version of Nappa's Level 4 [Why not give this to Turles?]) While the constant stage plus is nice, and means that this card will almost definitely see use, he wasn't the villainous Saiyan who needed the grease and his support kind of just strips someone else of getting the attention :/ An especially poignant one for me is Raditz, who I really hope gets some kind of new support in the set that's dedicated to his damn Father (preferably for use with Dynamic).
  14. I straight up didn't notice it when building the deck xD That's where it is. Huh, so it DOES double it post-modifiers. That said, thanks for the correction, though that is still a really efficient/effective way of buffing up your attacks from level 1 xD Edit: Though thinking about it, the math is still the same isn't it? If we treat it as the allies giving a +2, then you'd have 7 x 2 = 14, + 2 + 2 = 18. Heck, Turles' constant + Clench alone turns a 7 stage into an 18 stage regardless of order (I understand it's still strictly incorrect, but the end result is still pretty much the same).
  15. Hey, it's me, again. With another deck xD Saiyan Rampaging Turles So, the long story short on this one is I really want to make Turles work, and in a recent local thing, it was ruled that Saiyan Clench doubled both the stage damage of non AT-based cards AND the modifiers put on them. Going along with this, I noticed that Turles, from his level 1, carries a + 2 modifier and stops damage from being prevented. Add on Clench, and that becomes a + 4 modifier, as high as Broly and Nappa's from Level 1 (and hopefully turn 1). Of course, following this ruling, his level 3 would still be better. An active power + 3 stages (which becomes + 6), but unfortunately, that pesky Level 2 sits in the way and I don't want to rock an Unleashed build because I'm kind of sick of the card (even though the from deck attach would be fantastically helpful in my build). And even with the lowered Anger requirements, Rampaging has a harder time getting the anger for a level up than Empowered does. While Dynamic would help me camp at level 1, it also has no positive benefit, so yeah, Rampaging it is. Onto the deck; Main Personalities: Turles - Shadowy Turles - Watchful Turles - Triumphant Turles - Conquering Allies: Vegeta - Impatient x 1 Cell - Larval x 1 Straight up, both allies give a +1 to all attacks. If the Clench ruling is correct, that becomes a +2 each and they're fairly easy to get to the board. Cell also helps counter certain decks that are otherwise huge pains. Setup: Saiyan Extreme Training x 3 Tree of Might x 1 If you've seen my fairly recent Cell Jr. deck, you'll probably know my strong affinity for Extreme Training. It makes camping in a Saiyan deck incredibly viable, and beyond that, useful. Then Tree of Might is just extra Stage increasing (+4 with Clench). Events: Time is a Warrior's Tool x 1 Saiyan Sword Skill x 1 Saiyan Outrage x 3 Saiyan Enjoyment x 3 Straight up, I normally hate cards like Saiyan Enjoyment since I don't like giving up a card in hand to damage increasing and giving the opponent the extra action over me. Enjoyment, however, gives a draw, and a solid stage boost that gets ridiculous in this deck. Beyond that, Sword Skill is included for card draw and the ability to force skips out of the opponent (which can easily seal a game once you have a handful of damage modifiers on top of Turles). I've only managed it once so far, but swinging for 4 10+ stage attacks without the opponent being able to respond has promised the card a place in my deck (at 1). Drills: None. Physical Combat: I'll Dig Your Grave x 3 Saiyan Body Blow x 3 Saiyan Clench x 3 Saiyan Elbow Drop x 3 Saiyan Gut Kick x 3 Saiyan Headbutt x 3 Saiyan Lunge x 3 Saiyan Overhead Kick x 3 Saiyan Dive x 3 Saiyan Uppercut x 3 Saiyan Arm Catch x 3 Saiyan Blocking Technique x 2 Saiyan Escape x 2 The deck essentially operates around Saiyan Clench and attach cards, so you can probably figure out the reasoning behind each of these cards. I will point out that even if the ruling of Clench doubling attack bonuses is false, with all these stacks of damage modifier from Level 1, Turles can still easily hit up to 16-20 stages of damage per attack. Adding in something like I'll Dig Your Grave, which you're definitely not using to level up, you're going to be hitting as hard as Broly from the opening turns (12 stages with Clench, 16 with Turles, 20 with Tree of Might). Sadly, Saiyans don't have the absolute best range of flat stage damage cards, and I wanted to avoid freestyle attacks if possible, so this is how it currently looks. Energy Combat: Turles' Energy Ring x 3 Saiyan Crouch x 3 Saiyan Blockade x 3 I've always really liked Turles' Energy Ring tbh. I feel it's a bit sad that it doesn't really work to full efficiency in this deck, but the potential to swing twice for decent damage is worth it's inclusion. And with this, we come to my final thoughts with the deck. First off, I'd really like someone to back-up, or disprove, the ruling on Saiyan Clench. There was a lot of debate around it, and I can understand both sides of the argument. If it does work in this manner, then Turles becomes a terrifying Level 1. Beyond that though, the deck has real potential. How hard you swing right off the bat, regardless of your own power stages, and the fact that the damage can't be prevented works out really well. Sadly, Turles has terrible power stages defensively and you can still face big, big problems when facing down similar Nappa builds, or big ol' Broly. Besides that, being forced to level can be a real pain, though if you can set up Extreme Training before the opponent tries, it can be particularly funny when you swing for a Critical Effect instead (of course, this is when they use things like Clash of Wills, or otherwise try to force your anger up). Even if they do swing you up a level, you can honestly kind of use it to propel yourself to Turles' level 3, or try to push for an MPPV if you feel confident in your board. I will take this time now, after having tried out all the older Saiyan Personalities, to say that I find it curious how most of them have such drastic changes between levels. Turles gives stage buffs on his odd levels, and on his even levels, has some respectfully strong attacks. Similarly, it appears that Raditz on odds focuses on hand advantage, and on evens, focuses on Drills (and the same again goes for Vegeta, who has constant attack modifiers on odds and attacks on even). The simplest reality is that Turles (and all these other personalities) could see serious benefit from revamping the stacks to be more consistent in their levels. Even in light of this, however, Turles level 1/3 camp hits so hard that there's a good chance you won't notice this tidbit, and more importantly, he can hit out of the blue without warning (eventually hitting the point where every attack is 10-20 stages of damage). Final thought; I actually took this concept over to Red Ruthless, and built it around a similar principle of Level 1/3 Camp with all the attacks that stay in play for a second use. Not quite as strong in terms of raw damage, but a lot more aggressive and it'll put your opponent on a complete defensive or a race to Survival.